Word Research shows Sanskrit is the Oldest Language! (Post No.3709)

Compiled by London swaminathan

 

Date: 10 March 2017

 

Time uploaded in London:- 21-15

 

Post No. 3709

 

Pictures are taken from various sources; thanks.

 

contact; swami_48@yahoo.com

 

 

I gave some excerpts from “Vedic and Indo-European Studies” written by Nicholas Kazanas, (Aditya Prakashan, New Delhi, year 2015) yesterday.

 

Here are some more issues raised by him. I found his research into 400 words in Indo European languages very interesting. Here is what he says in his summary:

 

The second study is about, “Coherence and Preservation in Sanskrit” (published in Kumar 2009, 108 184, but revised since). Herein are examined more than 400 IE lexical items (nouns, verbs etc) occurring in the IE branches and denoting fairly common and as far as possible invariable things, qualities and activities like arm and foot, anger and love, father and mother, bowl and barley/grain, to breathe and to fly and so on. This study shows that Sanskrit lacks 53, some of which may well have not been PIE, Germanic lacks 145, Greek 149, Baltic 185 in 207, Celtic 210 and Slavic 215. Thus Sanskrit preserves a much larger stock whereas Greek, with its early and voluminous literature does not surpass Germanic, and Latin, with an almost equally early and rich literature, lags behind Germanic and Baltic. Another and perhaps more important aspect is that while many words appear in Germanic, Greek, Latin etc, only as isolated lexemes without a family of cognates (e.g. daughter’), in Sanskrit many such words have root- nouns, adjectives and verbal forms. Sanskrit has organic coherence. Both facts indicate that Sanskrit is by far the most archaic branch and most faithful to PIE.

PIE= Proto Indo-European

I E = Indo European

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Rig Vedic Poetry is better than Greek Poetry

The third study, “Rigvedic All-comprehensiveness reinforces the conclusion that Sanskrit is the most archaic of the IE branches and closest to PIE. In the second chapter are examined the lexical items. Here, in the third, are examined grammatical and poetical aspects and in every case the Vedic language and poetry are seen to contain everything found in one or two of the other branches. For instance, the Periphrastic Perfect is found in Hittite but not in ancient Greek or Latin (in both it appears as a later innovation), is also present in Vedic. The Greek poetry has strict metre but little or no alliteration where as Germanic poetry has as one of its basic elements alliteration but not strict metre: both of these are present in the poetry of Rig Veda.

 

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Vedic and Avestan

The fourth study, ‘Vedic and Avesta’ is very technical and shows that contrary to mainstream belief, Vedic is far older than Avestan. It shows also that it is the Iranians who moved out of the wider Saptasindhu to Bactria/Gandhara, then to South East Iran and North westward.

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  1. As the title Vedic and Indo-European Studies indicates, the volume consists of dealing with common in both areas so that one may illuminate the other. Following facts rather than conjectures and reasoning rather than repetition, I arrive at unorthodox conclusions that diverge from mainstream (usually mechanical) thinking.

 

The most significant conclusion is that the Rig Veda furnishes facts that militate against many prevalent notions in many disciplines and studies in academia like the beginning of language or religion. Another conclusion concerns the origins of the Indo Aryan or Vedic people and the obnoxious Aryan Invasion/Immigration Theory. The AIT (-Aryan Invasion Immigration Theory) is a major impediment in mainstream IE (Indo European) scholarship but it is not the only one. In fact this is an external structure established by other, internal or psychological tendencies like inattention, love of ease, mechanicalness, arrogance, obstinacy, ambition, greed etc, all sprouting from an unchecked ego; all these can be encapsulated in the triad arrogance, greed, ignorance (more in the sense of ignoring than not knowing). And it is these that often motivate us rather than love and promotion of truth, the primary purpose of all scholarship (And if your mind, dear reader, rejects all this as claptrap unrelated to scholarship, then it is in the thralls of the triad.)

 

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Research on Vedic God Rhbu

 

Let us now go to Greece holding in mind the adjective name rbhu ‘intelligent fashioner. Scholars generally agree that this word is cognate with English Germanic ‘elf’ ( Elf, Alp etc), Old Slavic rabh ‘servant’ and the name of the Greek poet-musician-hero Orpheus.

 

In the Rig Veda ( 1.20, 110; 3.60, 7.48 etc) the Rbhus are three brothers, sons Sudhanvan, who perform several miraculous deeds through the power of mind’. For instance, RV 4- 2 says “ratham ye cakruh suvrtam sucetaso a-vibvarantam manasas pari dhyaya.

The wise-ones who fashioned the fine-rolling, impeccable car by visionary power ‘dhi’- out of mind/ manas. But the three are often indicated as one. Thus in the RV the indicated by the singular Rbhu as one. Thus in the Rig Veda the name appears both in the singular and in the plural.  The three brothers, though mortal, thanks to their great mental power gain, the favour of the gods and stay in the mansion of the Sun god where they serve as priests and become immortal gods themselves.

 

–Subham–

 

 

Tamil or Sanskrit: Which is Older?

tamil-letters

Questions answered by London Swaminathan
Post No. 1176; dated 16th July 2014.

Dear Swamy

It appears that you are not inclined to clear my doubts. However, I started reading your posts regularly and trying to find answers’
Recently I read your following post

https://tamilandvedas.com/2014/07/15/basic-questions-about-tamils-hinduism/

Here too I wish for clarification for the following
Regards
N K M.
(This is the Second e mail from NKM)

nagari
Dear NKM,

I have given my answers below:

Qestion1.What is the difference between Panini grammar and Tolkappiyam Grammar?

Answer: I am not an expert on Paninian Grammar. My Sanskrit knowledge is limited. I have passed five Sanskrit Examinations and Five Bhagavad Gita exams conducted by the Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan, Mumbai. When I was a school boy I passed all the five Sanskrit exams conducted by Chittoor Samskrutha Bhasa Pracharini Sabha. I can claim some authority on Sangam Tamil literature. I have read the 27,000+ lines four times. It will take 2 years if you devote some time every day to complete one round. I have read Post Sangam books and Valmiki and Kamba Ramayanam and all the Saivite and Vaishnavite scriptures only once. With my limited knowledge I answer your questions:

Paninian grammar was written around 7th century BCE. Tolkappiyam was written around 1st century BCE or CE. My estimate is 5th century CE in the present form. I have given the reasons for it in my five articles in English and Tamil on Tolkappim and the author Tolkappian. If you hold the word index of Sangam Books and Post Sangam works in your hand, you can see lot of Tolkappian words are found only in Post Sangam Tamil literature. That is why no Tamil scholar dares to compare them.

Porulathikaram of Tolkappiyam is a later addition according to many scholars. My opinion is all the three Adikarams belong to fifth century CE. In short there is a 1000 year gap between Tolkappiyam and Panini.

Wikipedia also listed the name of the authors and their dating.

Paninian Grammar is far superior to Tolkappiam in structure and construction. (If I remember correct Kamil Zvelebil mentioned something like that in his book The Smile of Murugan).

Q2. Do Panini’s grammar has all three viz Sollathigaram. Porul adhikaram and Ezhuththu adhikaram?

Answer : Panini’s Ashtadyayi (Eight Chapters) is not divided in that way. In short there is no Porul Adhikaram which is unique to Tolkappiam. Patanjali’s Mahabhasya gives lot of examples in the commentary on Panini. So we come to know more about Panni’s India. Please read the book “India in Panini”. I borrowed it from University of London (SOAS) Library. A very interesting book.

Sol (Syntax) and Ezuthu (Alphabet, formation of Words) are dealt with by Panini, in addition to several other topics.

kalvettu

Q3. What is the difference between Vedic language and classical Sanskrit?

Answer : The difference between the Vedic Sanskrit (1500 BCE) and the classical Sanskrit ( from 3rd Century BCE) is the difference between the Sangam Tamil ( First Century BCE to 3rd Century CE) and Modern Tamil (18th Century CE). Without Tamil commentaries we would not understand the Sangam Tamil literature, particularly the iraichi porul (hidden meaning, implied meaning etc). There was no present, past, future tenses in Sangam Tamil. Vaiyapuri Pillay has given lot of examples about the development in Tamil Grammar when he dated Tirukkural and Tolkappiam. Please read Vaiyapuri Pillay’s works.

The natural law is “CHANGE IS INEVITABLE. EVERYTHING MUST CHANGE. NOTHING CAN REMAIN STATIC in THE UNIVERSE”. Whether it is Nataraja’s dance, or the simplest Hydrogen atom or the Universe or my wife’s blouse or our food habits everything is changing/moving.

A language changes every two hundred miles and every two hundred years. This is the thumb rule used by Max Muller for dating the Vedas.

Q4. While I understand Sanskrit words are in Tamil and Tamil words are in Sanskrit, how Sanskrit was considered as Deva basha and Tamil as common man language

Answer : You don’t need to worry much about this nomenclature. It is very simple. All the ancient Hindu scriptures are in Sanskrit. So people may call it a Divine language. No one said that Tamil is not a divine Bhasa. Kanchi Paramacharya says Tamil has more devotional hymns than Sanskrit, which is correct. The word “divine” is used for the Tamil language by many poets. I have given it in my blog.

Patanjali called Panini ‘Bhagavan Panini’ (divine Panini). Kamban called Valmiki ‘Divine Valmiki ( Deiva Maa Kavi)’. Valluvar is called ‘Deiva Pulavar’ in Tiruvalluva Malai. Homer is called ‘Divine Homer’ in Greek. I will call Subramanya Bharati a ‘Divine Poet’.

Patamala-1 000

Regarding Tamil words in Sanskrit:

No language is pure in the world. Our forefathers were NOT language fanatics. They freely used Sanskrit words in Sangam literature and later Tirukkural. In the same way Tamil words are in later classical Sanskrit. But I doubt about it in Vedic Sanskrit. I have shown that even great linguists like Suneet Kumar Chatterji are wrong to claim that ‘Neer’ (water) in Rig Veda is Tamil. I have shown that it is in the oldest Greek mythology (Nereids=Water Nymphs). When a word is found in other Indo European languages it is not counted as Dravidian even in etymological dictionaries. But old linguists misled many others and so ‘Neer’ is shown as Dravidian. I have also shown that Kapi, Tuki in the Bible are Sanskrit words. Please read my article “Sanskrit in The Bible”.

In this context, my pet theory is Tamil and Sanskrit originated from a common source on the Indian soil. This is what saints like Paranjothy Munivar and others believed 300 years ago. If we believe our Puranas and Tamil commentators, we accept that Agastya from the north came to South India and codified grammar for Tamil. He was sent by Shiva to balance the population (Please read my article “Population Explosion: Oldest Reference is in Hindu Scriptures”; posted on 2nd February 2013). Naturally Agastya would have done it on the basis of Sanskrit grammar. But even Shiva accepted Tamil as a separate language and entrusted the grammar work to great Agastya. Even Lord Shiva recognised the greatness and uniqueness of Tamil. Do we need any other certificate?

Q.5. Yet the literature in Sanskrit or other classical languages are equally comparable with Tamil literatures in richness and depth of literacy.

Answer : Tamil is one of the richest languages in the world. My opinion is that it will come next to Sanskrit and Greek in the quantity and quality of the literature. Then only Hebrew, Chinese and Latin will come. But among these languages Tamil is the junior most language except Latin. But Sanskrit literature is enormous like an ocean. No one has listed all the books in Sanskrit. In Tamil we have listed all the lost and available books. It will come in a handy book. But if you just compile the names of the Sanskrit books only, it will come in several volumes. In Tamil we have not got anything before 1st century BCE. But Sanskrit had a huge, very huge literature even before Homer started writing his first book in Greek language. Around that time, we had great women philosophers Maitreyi and Gargi attending World Philosophers Conference in Mithila. Even before Moses issued Ten Commandments all those Ten Commandments were in the Vedas.

sanskrit14

Q.6. Even though Kalidasa is controversial, why you are not providing constructive arguments for the Tamil poets antiquity?

Answer : Date of Kalidasa is not controversial. Though it is debatable, great art historians like Sivaramamurthy and several foreign and Indian scholars have dated him in the Pre Christian Era. Reverend G.U. Pope dated him Pre Kabila as soon as he read Kurinjipattu.

Though we date the Tamil poets around first century CE references in Mahavamsa, Mahabharata, Ramayana, Kalidasa and Asoka’s epigraph show that the Tamils existed long before the Sangam Period. I have written the following articles about Tamil antiquity in this blog:

Dravidian Queen (1320 BC) in North India (Posted April 14, 2012).

Valmiki in Tamil Sangam Literature (posted on 27 June 2013).

To Master the Tamil Language ……Keep a Calculator Handy! (12 Sept. 2011)

20000 Tamil Proverbs (1 June 2012)

Pandya King who Ruled Vietnam

How old is Indian Civilization? (Posted 25 September 2011).

Contact swami_48@yahoo.com

280 SANSKRIT WORDS FOR WATER!

By S Swaminathan

The Sanskrit language is the oldest, most systematic language that has survived the longest period through history. It is called Deva Bhasa-Language of the Gods. It is full of wonders, puzzles, riddles and miracles. It has got an ocean of treasures for anyone interested in any subject under the sun. No one has listed all the books in this language, because it is impossible to do so. This was the richest language in the ancient world. Even before Homer started writing his Iliad and Odyssey in 800 BC, Sanskrit had copious literature in the form of Vedic Samhitas, Brahmanas, Aranyakas and Upanishads.

 

Brihadaranyaka Upanishad written at the time of Homer, lists more than 60 generations of teachers! It means Hindus had proper schools for thousands of years even before others thought of writing books! No wonder still Mahabharata is the largest epic in the world with 100,000 couplets.

 

It has scored several firsts. First grammar book in the world: Ashtadyaye of Panini, First sex manual in the world: Kamasutra of Vatsyayana, First philosophical work: Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, First Story Collection in the world: Somadeva’s Katha Sarit Sagara, First religious book in the world Rig Veda and First Dance manual in the world Bharata’s Natya Sastra and First Dictionary of Synonyms Amarkosa. We can go on adding medical, aeroplane manuals etc. No Gilgamesh can even come nearer to Sanskrit literature. When other parts of the world dealt only with religion we started writing secular books.

 

Sanskrit has the power of expressing all types of thoughts in their appropriate terminology- from mythology to literature, science to philosophy, poetry to prosody, astronomy to anatomy, as well as genetics, mathematics and cosmology.

 

An amazing wealth of words and synonyms gives a great versatility to expression of power. With 65 words for earth, 70 words for water,15 words for gold,122 words for the verb “to go”, imagine its vastness!!

The seventy words for water multiply into 280 words with prefixes for specific descriptions of rainfall (dharma, karakam, thousaram, haimam) etc.

The Sanskrit speakers belong to India. Their civilization originated on the banks of Ganga, Sindhu, Saraswati (which disappeared 3000 years ago) and Yamuna. All these rivers were mentioned in Rig Veda, the oldest book in the world. They were so obsessed with water, they used it in all their ceremonies from birth to death. They used it to donate money or lands.They used it to give boons or curses. They used it in their weddings (Kanya Dhanam). This shows very clearly that they did not come from arid deserts or snowy regions. Without water a Hindu can’t do any ceremony.

 

Look at the  synonyms of water given below:

Amrutam ,Ambhaha, Arnaha,Apaha, Bhuvanam,Vanam,Kabandham, Kapandham,Udakam,Paathaha,Pushkaram,Savaram,Toyam, Dakam, Kambalam,Syandanam,Sadanam,Ira,Ambu,Kam,Jadaha,Somam,Vyoma,Naram,Kaharam,Saraha,Neeram,Udam,Saram,Rutam,Vaaha,Vaari,Salilam, Kamalam,Payaha,Keelaalam,Salam,Uurjam,Ghrutam,Vaajam,Sarilam, Jadam,Sambhaha,Andham,Kusham,Karburam,Ksheeram,Taamaram,Hriveram,

Sanchalam,Sambaram,Shambaram,Sambalam,Ghanarasaha,Jalapeetham,Jalam,Chandrorasam,Gokolanam,Sarvatomukham,Meghapushpam,Abhrapushpam,

Peeppalam,Kaandam,Krupeetam, Jeevanam, Komalam, Ghanisaasam, Krupperam, Repaalam, Akkam (colloquial in Brahmin families, might have given the word Aqua)

 

I have explained in another article that the word Neer/ water is not of Tamil origin ,because it is found in Greek as Nereids (water nymphs=Narayana of Hindu literature).

Compiled by S Swaminathan from various sources. For more Sanskrit Wonders read my blogs or contact swami_48@yahoo.com or Swaminathan.santanam@gmail.com