All posts tagged Number symbolism

1,2,3, 4……. NUMBER WORSHIPPING HINDUS (Post No.10,378)

WRITTEN BY LONDON SWAMINATHAN

Post No. 10,378

Date uploaded in London – –   25 NOVEMBER  2021         

Contact – swami_48@yahoo.com

Pictures are taken from various sources for spreading knowledge.

this is a non- commercial blog. Thanks for your great pictures.

tamilandvedas.com, swamiindology.blogspot.com

Whole world knows Hindus worship everything from tree, snake, rivers and hills to numbers and grammar. As a Hindu when I get up between 4 am and 4-30 am in London, I look at my right palm and I say ‘I salute you Lakshmi, Sarasvati and Govinda’ (Karaagre vasate Lakshmi……). The age old famous sloka is recited by millions of RSS workers as well in their Pratasmaran (Morning Thoughts). Just before stepping on the ground from the bed, they ask the ‘pardon of Mother Earth’. It is not only done by high class orthodox Brahmins but also by farmers before ploughing the land, wood cutters before cutting the trees and thieves before robbing the people. But nowadays thieves go to Tirupati Balaji and share their booty in the money box there! I mean the political robbers and film word black marketeers.

The idea is optimum use of everything with environmental awareness in mind. That is why they respect everything. In the Rig Veda, the oldest book in the world, even stones pressing Soma plant and Wooden spoons used to pur ghee in the fire have separate hymns.

Now let me tell you about two hymns in the Atharva Veda, where there is ONLY numbers. They are addressed to Vanaspati and the Bull. The first hymn is described as a charm to get prosperity for the people and the second one for the welfare of the cattle. But why do they numbers 1, 10, 100 and 1100 is NOT explained by anyone. Is it not like beating around the bush . They could have directly asked the gods Give me this, Give me that. In fact there is more into it.

Look at the hymn and I will give my opinion on it.

HYMN XV

A charm for general prosperity

1Plant! I have those who shall avert the threatened danger, ten
   and one. 
  O sacred Plant, produced aright! make sweetness, sweet thy self,
   for me.
2Twenty and two, O Plant, have I who shall avert the threatened
   ill.
  O sacred Plant, produced aright! make sweetness, sweet thyself,
   for me.

3Thirty and three, O Plant, have I who shall avert the threatened
   ill.
  O sacred Plant, produced aright! make sweetness, sweet thyself,
   for me.

4Forty and Four, O Plant, have I who shall avert the threatened
   ill.
  O sacred Plant, produced aright! make sweetness, sweet thyself,
   for me.

…….

…..

11Thousand and hundred, O Plant, have I who shall avert the threatened
   ill.
  O sacred Plant, produced aright! make sweetness, sweet thyself,
   for me.

It goes up to 11 in the same way

Ralph T H Griffith adds the following as footnote in his translation:-

Stanzas 3-11 of the hymn , which is a charm for general prosperity, are exactly the same with the exception of the numbers which increase by 11 in each stanza (thirty and three , forty and four, and so on ) up to one hundred and ten . In stanza 10 and 11 concluding with one thousand and one hundred.

XXX

NEXT MANTRA

HYMN XVI

A charm for the increase of cattle

1Bull! if thou art the single bull, beget. Thou hast no vital sap.

This is similar to the previous poem. The hymn is a charm for the increase and prosperity of the cattle. It goes up to 11 like the previous hymn.

Xxx

In the Rudram Chamakam (Anuvakam 11) Hymn of Yajur Veda

We have the following numbers

“Let me be granted the uneven number one, three, five, seven, Nine, eleven, thirteen, fifteen, seventeen, Nineteen, twenty one, twenty three, twenty five, twenty seven, twenty Nine, and thirty one, thirty three, and even numbers four, eight, twelve, and sixteen, twenty, and twenty four, twenty eight, thirty two thirty six, and forty and forty four, forty eight to ensure food and its production, its continuity, and the urge to enjoy, the origin of all productions, the sun, the heaven, the head of all, the infinite, the all pervading like the sky, time and the like present at the end of total consummation exists at the end of it on the earth as universal form, the Antaryami the immortal, the inner ruler of every thing, the omni present and omni potent.”

Odd numbers go up to 33

Even numbers go up to 48

xxxxxxx

My comments

Number symbolism is found in many cultures; but Sanskrit hymns are the oldest hymns with numbers. Even the most famous mantras  are known only with numbers E.g. Eka/1 Aksharam (Om), Pancha/5 Aksharam (Namasivaya) , Shat /6 Aksharam (Saravanabhava)  , Ashta/8 Aksharam (Narayanaya)etc.

But in the Yajur Veda the Chamakam numbers are not explained properly; here in Atharva veda also the explanation given by foreigners is wrong.

Traditionalists believe that Vedas are based on secret sounds and the proper recitation is more important than its meaning.

Another thing we see here is Ayurveda. Vanaspati (Head of Herbs or Herbal forest ) is addressed in the hymn.

One more point to be noted is Pati, Vati, Mati suffix which are found in the Rig Veda. Now we see them commonly in names such as Sarasvati, Ganapati and Indu Mati. We see the continuity throughout the Vedas and modern day naming of boys and girls. Hinduism is a Living Religion!

Later Tamil Siddhas also used this number symbolim

Yajur Veda Chamaka numbers in Sanskrit:-.              

एका च मेतिस्रश्च मेपञ्च च मेसप्त च मे

नव च म एकदश च मेत्रयोदश च मेपंचदश च मे

सप्तदश च मेनवदश च म एक विशतिश्च मे

त्रयोविशतिश्च मेपंचविशतिश्च मे

सप्तविशतिश्च मेनवविशतिश्च म

एकत्रिशच्च मेत्रयस्त्रिशच्च मे

चतस्रश्च मेऽष्टौच मेद्वादश च मेषोडश च मे

विशतिश्च मेचतुर्विशतिश्च मेऽष्टाविशतिश्च मे

द्वात्रिशच्च मेषट्त्रिशच्च मेचत्वरिशच्च मे

चतुश्चत्वारिशच्च मेऽष्टाचत्वारिशच्च मे

वाजश्च प्रसवश्चापिजश्च क्रतुश्च सुवश्च मूर्धा च

व्यश्नियश्चान्त्यायनश्चान्त्यश्च भौवनश्च

भुवनश्चाधिपतिश्च

–subham—

tags- Numbers, Atharva Veda, Number symbolism

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ONE MORE RIG VEDIC HYMN WITH NUMBER SYMBOLISM ! (Post N0.9260)

WRITTEN BY LONDON SWAMINATHAN

Post No. 9260

Date uploaded in London – –13 FEBRUARY 2021
Contact – swami_48@yahoo.com
Pictures are taken from various sources for spreading knowledge.
this is a non- commercial blog. Thanks for your great pictures.
tamilandvedas.com, swamiindology.blogspot.com

Number symbolism is found throughout Vedic hymns. Hymn 114 of Tenth Mandala also has lot of numbers in it and the Vedic “scholars” found it very difficult to translate it or interpret it. Many of the translators differ from traditional commentator Sayana. I read more in this hymn/ poem from another angle.
First let us look at the numbers in the Ten Mantras in the hymn RV 10-114
Here is Ralph T H Griffith’s translation who is very honest and admits that he is unable to understand hundreds of mantras in the Rig Veda. Others such as Max Muller, Dr Muir, Wilson and Ludwig give their own views. Like no two clocks agree they don’t agree with each other. Later day Tamil siddhas also followed this style and gave just numbers in their verses. At the end of this article I give two examples from Siva Vakkiyar and Tirumazisai Alvar where they repeat number 8 or 5 umpteen times in their verses they leave it to solve the number puzzle.
XXXX


RV 10-114
The Rig Veda/Mandala 10/Hymn 114
Translated by Ralph T.H. Griffith

  1. Two perfect springs of heat pervade the Three fold, and come for their delight is Matarisvan.
    Craving the milk of heaven the Gods are present: well do they know the praise song and the Saman.
  2. The priests beard far away, as they are ordered, serve the three Nirrtis, for well they know them.
    Sages have traced the cause that first produced them, dwelling in distant and mysterious chambers.
  3. The Youthful One, well-shaped, with four locks braided, brightened with oil, puts on the ordinances.
    Two Birds of mighty power are seated near her, there where the Deities receive their portion.
  4. One of these Birds hath passed into the sea of air: thence he looks round and views this universal world.
    With simple heart I have beheld him from anear: his Mother kisses him and he returns her kiss.
  5. Him with fair wings though only One in nature, wise singers shape, with songs, in many figures.
    While they at sacrifices fix the metres, they measure out twelve chalices of Soma.
  6. While they arrange the four and six-and-thirty, and duly order, up to twelve, the measures,
    Having disposed the sacrifice thoughtful sages send the Car forward with the Rc and Saman.
  7. The Chariot’s majesties are fourteen others: seven sages lead it onward with their Voices.
    Who will declare to us the ford Apnana, the path whereby they drink first draughts of Soma?
  8. The fifteen lauds are in a thousand places that is as vast as heaven and earth in measure.
    A thousand spots contain the mighty thousand. Vak spreadeth forth as far as Prayer extendeth.
  9. What sage hath learned the metres’ application? Who hath gained Vak, the spirit’s aim and object?
    Which ministering priest is called eighth Hero? Who then hath tracked the two Bay Steeds of Indra?
  10. Yoked to his chariot-pole there stood the Coursers: they only travel round earth’s farthest limits.
    These, when their driver in his home is settled, receive the allotted meed of their exertion.

XXXX

MY COMMENTS

1.In Mantra 8, Griffith talks about 15 types of prayers/lauds. Sayana talks about Indriyas/ sense organs.

2.In Mantra 3, we come across Two Birds; In another Upanishad mantra two bird sitting and one eats the berries- is interpreted as Paramatma and Jeevatma; Kanchi Paramacharya (1894-1994) says it was taken by the Christians and given in Adam and Eve (Atma and Jeeve atma) story

3.in Mantra 9, we come across 8th hero. Some describe it as Agni. Others differ.
4.In Mantra 8 , three times 1000 is repeated. Translators struggle to explain it.
5.Mantras 5, 6, 7 also have many numbers
6.Mantra three is very interesting Four Braided Woman is described as Vedic altar with four sides!
7.In Mantra we have Three Nirritis, who are usually associated with Death
8.Mantra two probably talks about the Big Bang and the expanding Univers whe they say “Sages have traced the cause that first produced them, dwelling in distant and mysterious chambers.”
9.Mantra 10 also stress this cosmological point when they say “Yoked to his chariot-pole there stood the Coursers: they only travel round earth’s farthest limits”
10.Mantra seven describe a place called Apnana (water ford?) which is rare.
11.Mantra 4 talks about one bird goes into the sea and looks around which reminds us of the bird that sailors use to fined out whether they are near shore/land. This bird is in Indus boat seal and Alvar song.
12.Mantra 4 has a beautiful expression “his Mother kisses him and he returns her kiss.”
This hymn is addressed to Visvedevas, but stress One God is seen as many/1000
Very interesting Hymn, but not translated correctly by the “scholars”
XXXX
Translators’ views
Mantra 1
Springs of heat – Agni and Surya ; Three fold- the universe , sky, firmament and earth; Matariswan – Vayu according to Sayana;
Three fold- Agni, Vayu, Surya says Ludwig.
Mantra 2
Nirritis -heaven, mid air an earth according to Sayana. Dawn , which by their regular appearance bring men nearer to death . Nirritis are linked to death.
Mantra 3
Four braided youth – Vedic altar
Two birds – probably Agni and Soma
According to Sayana husband and wife
Mantra 4
One – Agni as the sun. his mother, perhaps as prof. Ludwig says dawn
Mantra 6
Thirty six grahas are chalices or saucers for soma juice and four extra for Atyagniistoma sacrifice. The car = sacrifice.
Mantra 7
Majesties- may be mighty priests;
The ford Apanana – passage leading to sacrifice
Mantra 8
The mighty thousand – meaning is uncertain.
Wilson says 1000 places.
Dr muir says thousand times 15 Ukthas/ words.
According to Sayana every function of the body had its appropriate object.
Mantra 9
Eighth hero – Agni
XXX
EXCEPT TENTH MANTRA, ALL OTHERS HAVE NUMBERS

HERE IS THE FULL HYMN IN DEVANAGARI

घ॒र्मा समं॑ता त्रि॒वृतं॒ व्या॑पतु॒स्तयो॒र्जुष्टिं॑ मात॒रिश्वा॑ जगाम ।
दि॒वस्पयो॒ दिधि॑षाणा अवेषन्वि॒दुर्दे॒वाः स॒हसा॑मानम॒र्कं ॥

ति॒स्रो दे॒ष्ट्राय॒ निर्ऋ॑ती॒रुपा॑सते दीर्घ॒श्रुतो॒ वि हि जा॒नंति॒ वह्न॑यः ।
तासां॒ नि चि॑क्युः क॒वयो॑ नि॒दानं॒ परे॑षु॒ या गुह्ये॑षु व्र॒तेषु॑ ॥
Samhita Devanagari Accented
चतु॑ष्कपर्दा युव॒तिः सु॒पेशा॑ घृ॒तप्र॑तीका व॒युना॑नि वस्ते ।
तस्यां॑ सुप॒र्णा वृष॑णा॒ नि षे॑दतु॒र्यत्र॑ दे॒वा द॑धि॒रे भा॑ग॒धेयं॑ ॥
एकः॑ सुप॒र्णः स स॑मु॒द्रमा वि॑वेश॒ स इ॒दं विश्वं॒ भुव॑नं॒ वि च॑ष्टे ।
तं पाके॑न॒ मन॑सापश्य॒मंति॑त॒स्तं मा॒ता रे॑ळ्हि॒ स उ॑ रेळ्हि मा॒तरं॑ ॥
Samhita Devanagari Accented
सु॒प॒र्णं विप्राः॑ क॒वयो॒ वचो॑भि॒रेकं॒ संतं॑ बहु॒धा क॑ल्पयंति ।
छंदां॑सि च॒ दध॑तो अध्व॒रेषु॒ ग्रहा॒न्त्सोम॑स्य मिमते॒ द्वाद॑श ॥
ष॒ट्त्रिं॒शांश्च॑ च॒तुरः॑ क॒ल्पयं॑त॒श्छंदां॑सि च॒ दध॑त आद्वाद॒शं ।
य॒ज्ञं वि॒माय॑ क॒वयो॑ मनी॒ष ऋ॑क्सा॒माभ्यां॒ प्र रथं॑ वर्तयंति ॥
चतु॑र्दशा॒न्ये म॑हि॒मानो॑ अस्य॒ तं धीरा॑ वा॒चा प्र ण॑यंति स॒प्त ।
आप्ना॑नं ती॒र्थं क इ॒ह प्र वो॑च॒द्येन॑ प॒था प्र॒पिबं॑ते सु॒तस्य॑ ॥
Samhita Devanagari Accented
स॒ह॒स्र॒धा पं॑चद॒शान्यु॒क्था याव॒द्द्यावा॑पृथि॒वी ताव॒दित्तत् ।
स॒ह॒स्र॒धा म॑हि॒मानः॑ स॒हस्रं॒ याव॒द्ब्रह्म॒ विष्ठि॑तं॒ ताव॑ती॒ वाक् ॥
Samhita Devanagari Accented
कश्छंद॑सां॒ योग॒मा वे॑द॒ धीरः॒ को धिष्ण्यां॒ प्रति॒ वाचं॑ पपाद ।
कमृ॒त्विजा॑मष्ट॒मं शूर॑माहु॒र्हरी॒ इंद्र॑स्य॒ नि चि॑काय॒ कः स्वि॑त् ॥
भूम्या॒ अंतं॒ पर्येके॑ चरंति॒ रथ॑स्य धू॒र्षु यु॒क्तासो॑ अस्थुः ।
श्रम॑स्य दा॒यं वि भ॑जंत्येभ्यो य॒दा य॒मो भव॑ति ह॒र्म्ये हि॒तः ॥

–subham–

tags- number symbolism, Rig Veda, RV 10-114

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by Tamil and Vedas on February 13, 2021  •  Permalink
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A RIG VEDIC HYMN WITH NUMBER SYMBOLISM (Post No.7566)

RESEARCH ARTICLE WRITTEN BY London Swaminathan

Post No.7566

Date uploaded in London – 12 February 2020

Contact – swami_48@yahoo.com

Pictures are taken from various sources for spreading knowledge; this is a non- commercial blog.

 A RIG VEDIC HYMN WITH NUMBER SYMBOLISM

Rig Veda, the oldest religious book in the world, the oldest anthology in the world and the oldest document of Hinduism, throws many challenges to Hindu and western scholars. The eighth Mandala of the book is very interesting. We see a lot of foreign stuff here extending up to Iran including Dhana/gifts of camels to Brahmins. Number symbolism seen here is one of the challenges which allows commentators to interpret a verse differently. Tamil Siddhas ad Saivite poet Tirumular followed this style with great enthusiasm.

In all ancient religions, mythology came first and then the religious hymns. But in Hinduism the hymn book Rig Veda is placed at least two thousand years before the 18 Hindu Puranas (Hindu Mythology). Though linguistically speaking the prose Puranas can be placed after the Vedas, the stories in them go back several thousand years. For instance, if a Saivite Purana talks about the Blue throated Shiva and the story behind the blue throat (Neela kanda), the words (Neela Kanda) are already in the Veda.  If a Vaishnavite Purana talks about Vishnu’s Three Steps, the reference can be found in the Rig Veda. So it is clear that Puranaic episodes came first and written later.

The story of Maruts (Rig Veda 8-28) is in the Bala Kanda of Valmiki Ramayana.

xxx

7X7 gods, 7X9 gods in Rig Veda 8-28

Here is a reference about the origin of Maruts. Briefly described as sons of Rudra and attendants of Indra. The storm god is found even in Sumerian (Babylonian) worship as God Martu.

In later days we have

Maruti –  son of wind god is worshipped in nook and corner of India as Hanuman, Anjaneya

Maruti car is running in India everywhere.

Sanda maarutam (gale fore wind) and Mantha maarutham (breeze) are used in Tamil novels etc.

These Maruts are found in Rig Veda with interesting and puzzling Numbers!

Here is the hymn 8-28 from Rig Veda

1.The Thirty Gods and the Three besides, whose seat hath been the sacred grass,

From time of old have found and gained

2.Varuna, Mitra , Aryaman, Agni, with the

Consorts sending boons,

To whom our Vasat! is addressed

3.These are our guardians in the west and

 northward here, and in the south

And on the east , with all the tribe.

4.Even as the gods desire so verily shall it

 be. None minisheth this power of theirs,

No demon and no mortal man.

5.The Seven carry Seven spears; Seven are

the splendours they possess

And Seven glories they assume.

For our number symbolism and the origin of Maruts, let us take stanza/mantra 5 only. Griffith whose translation is given above, comments —

The seven

The Maruts, seven  or seven times nine, or seven times seven  in number. Saayana mentions the legend of their birth, which will be found in Ramayana book 1, cantos 46,47. The meaning is merely that the Maruts carry lances , that is their, lightnings, and are splendidly adorned.

We get 33 gods and then 49 and then 63.

Thirty three is expanded as thirty three crores of gods (330 million) in Puranas , just an exaggeration to boost  their importance. Hindus always add a big decimal number for exaggeration.

They used to say

King Dasaratha has 60,000 wives (meaning is ‘several wives’, unusually high)

In Weddings priests announce ‘Uncle of the bride gifts ‘laksham katti varahan’ (one hundred thousands of gold bars consisting of Varahan gold coins) – meaning is his ‘Rs100 is worth billions’.

Hindus have 33 crore (330 million) gods (meaning is Hindus can worship God in every form, every object)

But later Puranas explained 33 gods as 8 Vasus+12 Adityas+ 11 Rudras + Indra+ Prajapaati (or Two Asvins).

xxx

Story of Maruts from Ramayana

When Diti’s sons were killed in the Churning of the Milky ocean incident, she requested her husband that she should have one son who will be the slayer of Indra ; her husband Kashyapa asked her to do a penance for 1000 years. She did so, but when ten years were remaining, Indra came and entered her when she was lying in the wrong posture. Indra cut the foetus into seven parts and she cried  Indra said ‘Ma Ruda= Cry Not = Marut’.

She requested Indra to allow them to live and Indra told her they will be the guardians of seven winds. They were divided into three parts (7+7+7)

Xxx

The Puranic dictionary by John Dowson summarises it in the following passage: –

“The storm gods who hold a very prominent place in the Vedas and are represented as friends and allies of Indra. Various origins are assigned to them. They are the sons of Rudra, sons and brothers of Indra, sons of the oceans, heaven and earth (7+7+7). They are armed with lightning and thunderbolts, and ride on the whirlwind and direct the storm.

The number of them is said in one place to be thrice sixty ( 3+60) and in another only twenty seven.

In the Ramayana they are represented to have their origin in an unborn son of Diti whom Indra dashed into 49 pieces with his thunderbolt (7X7), and in compassion converted into Maruts.

Another commentator on Vedas say , that after their  Siva and Parvati beheld them in great affliction, and the latter asked Siva to transform the lumps on flesh into boys of like form, like age and similarly accounted, and gave them to Parvati as her sons and hence they are called the sons of Rudra.

The legend is invented to explain those passages of the Vedas which make Maruts the sons of Rudra.

MY COMMENTS

It is very simple. If you collect all the English poems on rain or thunder, you will see different interpretations, imageries, similes etc from different poets.

Vedic poets described thunder and rain of Indra assisted by storm and lightning of Marut.

What is the purpose?

The dialogue poems of Rig Veda show that after every sacrifice, there was an Entertainment Show in which two groups acted sitting opposite. Dialogue Hymn between Indra and Marut is the proof for it (RV 1-165).

Probably the Diti – Indra chapters in Ramayana (1-46, 47) are also acted on stages and Viswamitra recited this story to Rama and Lakshmana.

But on another plane, these poems have hidden meaning. In all Tamil Sangam Akam verses (Family/ sex verses) all the natural phenomena have hidden meanings as explained by the later commentators. Sangam Tamil Poems are from first few centuries of Common Era and the commentaries are from 13th century or later. We find the names of the poets and words in the verses are explained as fancifully as Ma Ruda- Don’t Cry- Maruta!

Since Rudra is also a storm god in the Vedas, Maruts/lightnings are described as sons of Rudra.

 In short, a poem on lightning is explained/interpreted in different ways.

Why different numbers (21, 27, 49 and 63) are given?

You can count the lightning streaks in any number depending based on your imagination. But Hindus has a fascination for Number Seven. Anything holy or everything holy is divided into Seven. We see this Number Seven in Indus- Sarasvati Civilization seals more than other numbers. Another holy number 3 is also seen in it.

—subham–

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by Tamil and Vedas on February 12, 2020  •  Permalink
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DIRGATAMAS HYMN- A RIDDLE IN THE RIG VEDA (Post No.4453)

Written by London Swaminathan 

 

Date: 2 DECEMBER 2017 

 

Time uploaded in London-  20-45

 

 

Post No. 4453

Pictures shown here are taken from various sources such as Facebook friends, Books, Google and newspapers; thanks.

 

The Rig Vedic hymn 1-164 is a great hymn. Probably that is the longest hymn in the oldest book in the world with 52 mantras. It is like an encyclopaedia touching various subjects. It is a riddle because the poet Dirgatamas has used lot of numbers which can be interpreted in many ways. In fact Wilson, Max Muller, Ludwig, Hillebrandt, Griffith, Grasmann and many imitation western Sayanas gave their own interpretations. Even our own Sayana was struggling with the meaning of the mantras. The story of Dirgatamas itself is interesting. He was a blind poet like Homer who lived 100 years. His name meant Long Darkness.

 

First let me give you a beautiful comment on the Hymn RV 1-164 by Umapada Sen in the introduction of his book titled ‘The Rig Vedic Era’ (Calcutta, 1974):–

The Veda is an Indian mass product of a highly advanced civilised society based on class co-operation. It flowered spontaneously, breathing in Indian atmosphere, unassailed by extraneous influences for several centuries, till it was stifled by abrupt and strange appearance of liturgical codes of completely different character.

The clamour for ambiguity or inefficient articulation of the Vedic hymns by the protagonists need not be deplored. The critics should do justice to themselves in case they just take the pains to go through the hymns addressed to the Visvedevas or only the Hymn RV 1-164 and concentrate to find out the meaning of their own accord. Invariably it will dawn that the hymns are ovations addressed to all the luminaries, the then gods to the Rig Vedic singers. The sun, moon, nakshatras (stars), Sapta Rishis (Ursa Major), Pole star (Dhruva) and others being mentioned and their functions, inter related with astral phenomena, minutely described in a riddle type song sung by a poet soliciting a solution.

 

The humble effort in solving the quiz has mainly been confined in rationally arranging the translation of Indologists when necessary and nothing further. Only the respective solutions, e.g. where a luminary is seen to revolve in a chariot with no wheels the axle only spinning without linear motion;  seven luminaries bearing seven distinct names journeying in a chariot but with seven wheels following the sun’s track closely; the variant sun Vishnu, never making a journey in a chariot, encompassing the entire expanse only with three strides and relate to the pole star so on, have been offered.

Logical deductions are palpably conspicuous and do not depend on superfluous elucidation or interpretations of the verses in greater details. It is apparent that the above mentioned allusions respectively relate to the pole star, the Sapta Rishis (Ursa Major), seven planets, Vishnu’s sun (and not ordinary sun’s) three typical positions in the ecliptic, now known as the cardinal points, where through Vishnu’s annual revolution is completed. It would have been sheer folly if any other explanation was suggested. Nowhere, any farfetched idea has been construed or imported, nor any artificial rendering was adopted to spin a yarn or obliterate the real purport of the verse to suit the present deductions.”

xxx

This verse is famous for a few other statements and quoted very frequently for those statements:

 

 

(1).Truth is one; scholars call it with different names!

“They call him Indra, Mitra, Varuna, Agni and he is heavenly nobly-winged Garutman.

To what is One sages give many a title; they call it Agni, Yama, Matariswan”-RV 1-164-46

 

(2).Speech has Four Divisions!

“Speech has been measured out in four divisions, the Brahmins who have understanding know them

Three kept in close concealment cause no motion; of speech, men speak only the fourth division.”—1-164-45

 

Four divisions of speech are

Four Types

1.Paraa, 2.Pasyantii, 3.Madhyamaa, 4.Vaikharii

Chathvaari vaak parimitaa padaani taani vidurbrahmanaa ye maniishinah

Rik Veda 1-164-45

Saayanaa in his commentary mentioned that the four types mentioned by the seers are Paraa, Pasyantii, Madhyamaa and Vaikharii.

 

(3).Adam and Eve Story from the Rig Veda!

“Two birds with fair wings, knit with bonds of friendship, in the same sheltering tree have found a refuge.

One of the twain eats the sweet Fig tree’s fruitage; the other eating not regadeth only” 1-164-20

Kanchi Paramacharya has rightly pointed out that this gave birth to the Story of Adama and Eve and Adam eating the forbidden fruit.

Adam= ADma=Atma

Eve= Jeev (Jeevatma)

Sayana says that the two birds are the vital and the Supreme spirit, dwelling in one body. The vital spirit enjoys the fruit or rewards of actions while the Supreme Spirit is merely a passive spectator.

 

(4).Number Symbolism

“Seven to the one-wheeled chariot yoke the Courser;bearing seven names the single Courser draw it.

Three-naved the wheel is, sound and undecaying, whereon are still resting alhese worlds of being.”- 1-164-2

 

“The seven who on the seven wheeled car are mounted to have horses, seven in tale, who draw them onward.

Seven sisters utter songs of praise together, in whom the names of the seven cows are treasured.”- 1-164-3

Seven Sisters seal is found in the Indus valley civilisation as well.

The Seven: according to Sayana, the seven solar rays, or seven divisions of the year.

Seven sisters: Probably the seven celestial rivers, which as emblems of fertility may bear the name of cows.

 

Dirgatamas is playing with numbers! he used numbers 1 to 10 to denote various things. It gives scope for new interpretations touching from Astronomy to Zoology.

Tamil mystic poets Tirumular, tirumazisai Alvar and Siva vakkiyar followed this number symbolism in their poetry, but 2000 years after Dirgatamas.

 

(5). Vedic Metres

Seven Vedic Metres including Gayatri are mentioned by the poet.

(6) The Path of Knowledge

Unknowing, I ask of those  who know – the sages

as one ignorant for the sakeof knowledge;

who is that ONE in the form of the Unborn

that has supported these six spheres of the world? 1-164-6

 

(7). What is the use of Veda?

What will he do with the hymn of the Veda

who does not know its theme—the Eterna

in the supreme region, in which the Devas dwell?

But those who have come to know That are perfect. – 1-164-39

 

(8).Words of Ambiguity

Boneless one, Unborn image, Suprna, Five-footed, the single, Triplet, the buffalo, Garutman, the Sadhyas, Sraswati etc.  are interpreted differently.

Dirgatamas was one of the latest poets of the Rig Vedic period. Rig Veda covers a time span of at least 500 years. If we cant even understand Dirgatamas, how are we going to understand more ancient poets?

 

As Umapada Sen says one must read the entire hymn and come to one’s own conclusion. Don’t depend upon Western Sayanas’ interpretations. They were not Hindus and moreover they did not live the life of Indians. Unless one lives in the culture, one cannot understand the full meaning, thrust, import and significance of the poem or hymn.

 

(I will give the story of Dirgatamas separately)

–Subham–

 

 

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by Tamil and Vedas on December 2, 2017  •  Permalink
Posted in Religion, Sanskrit Literature
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Posted by Tamil and Vedas on December 2, 2017

https://tamilandvedas.com/2017/12/02/dirgatamas-hymn-a-riddle-in-the-rig-veda-post-no-4453/

Numbers in the Rig Veda! Rig Veda Mystery-2

Vedas 9

Research Paper written by London Swaminathan
Post No. 1265; Dated 3rd September 2014.

There are as many bluffers in the field of Rig Vedic study as we have in the study of Indus Valley script. The so called Vedic “scholars” from foreign countries bluffed us into believing that they were real scholars. Actually they used Sanskrit Pundits for translation into colloquial English and then interpreted the hymns in English and German according to their whims and fancies. They dubbed some characters as demons and some as devas, Mundas, Aryas, Dravidas etc. The same thing happened in the study of Indus valley Civilization. They interpreted the script according to their imagination. The day the script is deciphered, thousands of books will be burnt as rubbish. They are like circus clowns and buffoons!

Numbers occur in the Vedas in innumerable places. Vedic numbers are mysterious. The Vedic seers had an obsession with the numbers. They used number symbolism making it difficult for interpretation. This led to a new genre of obscure poetry in later day Tamil literature.

I submitted two Research papers at the World Tamil Conference in 1995 in Thanjavur: 1.NUMBER IN SAGAM TAMIL LITERATURE and 2.COLOUR IN SAGAM TAMIL LITERATURE. Since they were submitted after the deadline they did not enter the books. But I attended seminars for two days in different rooms and distributed them personally. From that day I have a fascination about numbers. Here are some facts about numbers in the Vedas. The only oldest religious book in the world used till today is the Rig Veda. It has got decimal numbers 10, 100, 1000, 100,000 in hundreds of places. Hindus discovered the decimal system and the biggest numbers.

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Following is only a sample of the numbers in the Rig Veda:
RV 5-29-8 3X100 =300 No of offerings of Soma
8-85-8 63 No of Maruts
10-34-8 53 No of Dice 50+3
10-114-6 36 No of Saucers 33+3
10-53-3 34 No of Lights 33+1
8-28-1 33 No of Gods
3-4-9 33 No of Gods

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How many People did Indra kill?

RV 6-26 100,000 number of people killed by Indra
RV 6-26 60,000 number of people killed by Indra
RV 4-30 100,000 number of people killed by Indra
RV 1-53 10,000 20 captains+60099+10000
RV6-27 3000 number of people killed by Indra
RV 2-14-6 100X 1000 persons killed
2-13-9 100X10 Dasas killed
2-14-6 100,000 100X1000 killed
7-19-14 6666 No of Dasas killed 3300+3300+33+33
(AV9-5-2) 6333 No of Gandharvas
RV3-9-9 3339 No of Gods (3003+303+33)
((Satapata Brahmana 3306 No of Gods (3003+303) )
RV4-27-6 3000 No of Warriors killed 3X1000

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How many Forts did Indra destroy?

RV 2- 14 100 Ancient castles
RV 1-130 90 forts
RV 1-53 100 forts

RV10-98-10 99000 No of wagon loads (100 000—1000=99000)
RV 1-54-6 99 Forts of Sambara 100-1
2-19-6 99 Forts of Sambara 100-1
10-98-11 99000 No of wagons 100000—10000
1-130-7 90 forts of Dasas
8-1-24 1100 steeds of Indra 1000+100
10-97-1 107 No of Herbs 100+7
10-130-1 101 No of ministers 100+1
10-93-15 77 No of horses 70+7

vedas5

8-6-46 100,000 No of Gifts
8-5-37 100+10,000 100 camels and 10,000 cows gifted
8-46-32 100 100 camels donated
10-93-15 77 Number of horses 70+7
8-85-8 7X9 No of Maruts
5-52-7 7X7 No of Maruts
10-55-3 5×7 No of Gods
10-90-15 3X7 Maruts
7-9-11 21 persons killed 7X3

2-12 40 shambara was found after 40 autumns
7-18 10 Dasa Raja yuddha
5-62-1 1000 Thousand Pillar Hall
1-116-3 100 Hundred oared ship saves Bhujyu

RV 1000 many contexts

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1) We can see a pattern in using the numbers here. So they don’t mean it literally.
2) 99, 99,000 and such numbers are symbolic.
3. Killing 100, 000 may mean killing a lot of people; not necessarily exactly one lakh!
4.The word “Kill”– itself may have different meaning
5.Look at the camel and Cow donations. So they are not nomads from snow clad Siberia!
6.Look at the 1000 pillared Mandap (Hall). Vedic seers are great architects.
7.Look at the 100 oared huge ship. They are marine engineers and navigators!
8.Look at the wagon loads. You can imagine the great transport in those days
9.Look at the decimal system throughout the Vedas. It shows that they are all sons of the soil and not from outside because neither Bible nor Sumerian nor Egyptian has such uniform decimal numbers. Semitic people did not know big numbers.

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Vishnu Sahasranamam of Mahabharata says Sahasra Koti Yugadharine Nama: (Ten thousand Million Yugas! Yuga itself a very big number!). Semitic literature is obsessed with number Forty or 3X40=120– not above that!

My previous research articles on RV and AV:-
1.The Mysterious Vedic Homa Bird: Does it exist? – posted on 10-12-2011
2.Vedic Hymn better than National Anthems
3.Vedas and Egyptian Pyramid Texts – posted on 29-8-2012
4.Kapinjala Bird Mystery –posted on 23-5-2014 (Post No 1060)
5. Most misinterpreted words :Asva and Ayas
6.Confusion about Vedic Soma Plant –posted on 5-5-2013
7.Horse Headed Seer: Rig Veda Mystery- 1 -posted 27-8-2-14
8.Cucumber in the Rig Veda – posted on 2-42014 (post no 950)
9.Origin of Horse race and Chariot Race –posted 25-8-2014
10.Creation: Vedic Hymn and Babylonian Hymn –posted 6-8-2013
11.Sex Mantras and Talismans in Egypt and the Atharva Veda –posted 26 Sept. 2012
12.Gems from the Atharva Veda – posted 27 Sept. 2013
13.Mysterious Atharva Veda: Part 1 –posted 30 Sept. 2013
14. Mysterious Atharva Veda: Part 2 – posted 7 Oct 2013
15).27 Similes in one Vedic Hymn! – posted on18-8-2012
16) 107 Miracle Herbs in Rig Veda – posted on16-9-2013
17)Vedic Origin of 1000 Pillar Halls in Indian and Mayan Culture – 5 July 2014
And several other articles linking Vedic Gods Agni, Varuna and Indra in Tolkappiam and the Indus Valley Civilization. Please read my 1000+ articles.
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Contact swami_48@yahoo.com

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by Tamil and Vedas on September 3, 2014  •  Permalink
Posted in Culture, Religion
Tagged , , ,

Posted by Tamil and Vedas on September 3, 2014

https://tamilandvedas.com/2014/09/03/numbers-in-the-rig-veda-rig-veda-mystery-2/